Well, Louisa and I got to talking a while ago (hehe, yes, I know, I'm finally making the post), and we came to a few conclusions. One of them is that we actually can sustain two games at once. That should be obvious from Legend's initial ability to survive and grow, but then start to flutter. Naturally, we started theorising on what went wrong, some of the things being that we have too large a scope (world), and probably should have tried to start with the crossover rather than the individual stories.
So... what to do?
Much as we'd like to continue with FL, we're not sure if there's the impetus to continue, which is too bad. So we started brainstorming for other ideas, if we wanted to try to support something else again at the same time. And came up with an idea for a general setting, which should have enough appeal. Especially for the Sci-Fi fans.
Star Wars.
Here's a few of our thoughts: time-wise, we're looking at shortly after Supreme Chancellor Palpatine declares himself Emperor. And yes, we are discounting Episodes I-III in our chronology. At this time, Anakin has become Darth Vader, and the purge of the Jedi is well underway. We'd be dealing with the rise of the New Order, and its slide into tyranny, so there should be plenty of potential for conflict - since the way the Emperor basically came to power, according to all the source material, was looking totally averse to power.
More specifically, we're thinking of something like a Babylon 5-style space station - it would be an economic centre in the local area of space at the very least. So, hopefully small enough to have us interacting; think of it as basically having a permanent population roughly the size of a large city. We have more specific notes on that, and will be glad to post them if there's enough interest.
Also, one final thought: all of the Jedis would be NPC. Mainly because they present the same problems as a Slayer would in terms of being overpowering to the story.
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So, why post this in here? Mainly to give everyone else first crack. Also to avoid getting Dave deluged with e-mails.
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LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Moving away from FL for a second and back to Adam's star wars idea I think excluding Jedi as player characters is a bad idea. Yes in this era they're potentially more powerful but I don't see that being as great an issue. The more powerful a player character jedi is the faster their appointment with Vader comes, since I presume we're not ditching Episodes 4 to 6 then any meeting between Vader and a jedi is going to be a loss for the good guys.
So long as we make it abundantly clear that if you play a jedi (especially a powerful one)
a. The Emperor will notice you
b. He will send Vader after you.
c. Vader will hunt you down and kill you.
Then I have no problem with someone playing a jedi. In fact I imagine there are some interesting stories to be told. Excluding the Jedi means removing a big part of what makes Star Wars different. Without them we might as well be playing some generic Sci-fi game.
Though this is to some degree moot since I won't be playing. I have enough trouble right now writing for LABN and FL three games would be simply impossible.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Well our main concerns with Jedi were basically the problems of everyone wanting to become Jedi, or the overpowering aspect - especially since there could be reasons to wonder strictly if an appointment with Vader MUST come. After all, Yoda managed to hide on Dagobah, though he had a cave replete with Dark Side energy to mask his presense.
But mostly, you raise good points, though there is the problem of limit (and when we were initially discussing this, we had the Republic as our timeline). More people are probably going to get excited over being a Jedi Knight than a hotshot pilot or bounty hunter, or something similar. It's just the way that people are, when it comes to who they identify with.
Ah well. Must get back to doing mailers for the moment.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
And now I discover a printing problem, and get time to include backstory. :)
I really, really can't stand Episodes I and II, particularly since Lucas has to rewrite the Original Trilogy and some of the Sourcebook material for it to work. We know some things from other books, the most notable one being the Heir to the Empire trilogy. I'll hide this next bit from Heather, since she may want to read them after finding out that I remember hearing that unlike some of the other books, they supposedly had more input from Lucas.
[hide]We know that the Emperor had more than just Vader working for him, able to use the Force. There was, at least, the guardian of Mount Tantiss. More signifigantly, we know the Emperor had a group of people working for him titled `The Emperor's Hand` who were trained in the Force; Thrawn knew a lot about the Emperor's resources, and was probably correct when he referred to `or any of his other Hands.`
We also know that the Emperor had humans trained to hunt Jedi (Jedi Academy), and that they actually had technological tools capable of telling if you were even more sensitive to the Force.[/hide]
Anyway, the main concern is also the ability to overpower and centralise the story. Part of the thing which attracts us to LABN is that we don't have a single person who is needed for it; if any one of us runs out of time, or loses interest, we really don't have to worry about the game tanking. It's the reason our one Slayer was an NPC.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Don't forget that there are also high-dealing merchants, shady diplomats, backwater farmers, quirky droids, pirates, Military (and Ex-Military) officers, spies, counter-spies, assassins (and an assassins guild), explorers, miners, prisoners, criminals aplenty (both justified and wrongly accused), priests of the Force(who aren't Jedi themselves) and Aliens (of all sorts).
Theres a lot more in the Star Wars universe than Jedi. But the Jedi get the mega-cool factor item - A light Saber (or Sabre if you prefer). Nothing really compares to that - Even the Force.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
In response to Robin's comment:
"Excluding the Jedi means removing a big part of what makes Star Wars different. Without them we might as well be playing some generic Sci-fi game. "
The problem with having a Jedi player is that they stand head and shoulders above the other PCs. I think a Jedi NPC would be very interesting. Let us say that we are the assembled retinue of a high-powered NC Jedi named Grag Hal. We represent his household, friends, family and droids and closest trusted allies. We are all fleeing Vader and his Sith.
Sometime in the first episode/movie he gets killed but he gives us a missive ... a message that must be delivered to Yoda whever he is hiding. It represents the last hope of the Jedi Knights. It is our fate to carry that message to Dagobah for him.
Grag Hal (and perhaps one or two of the company who may have been with him) realized that the planet where they had hidden once before was actually an ancient school fo Jedi training that had predated the Jedi Knights. This proto school had been a legend in the origin of the Jedi. It may have even been the home-planet of the first race to discover midiclorians.
This information must not fall into the hands of Vader and the Emporer, such a loss would be terrible. But Yoda, the last Jedi Master, and the one whom all the others are sworn to protect must be made to known of this discivery so that once Vader is defeated the Jedi can be reborn.
So you see where this is going...Jedi flavored, but no Jedi in our group. Just one way it could go without being "just another sci-fi game"
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Bloody hell, I go away for three days and LNG gets redesigned and a new game is proposed...
And its Star Wars! W000tt!
Some of you may know that I have a great love for star wars (and any other lovers out their who want to read SW books they can't/don't want to buy...let me know 8) ), have read a great number of the books and am currently DMing a pen and paper SW RPG for me mates. Admittedly, its set in the New Jedi Order era (imho SW gets better after the films) but, hey, I'd still so be up for a SW game whatever era its set in!
So, do I have anything constructive to add? Well, yes. After reading what Dave wrote above, it seems to me that everybody has forgotten something. Adam proposed this game would be set during the rise of the Empire/fall of the Old Republic (I'm a post-films fan. Its always going to be the 'Old' Republic to me :P). Yes, during this time the Jedi Purge is pretty prominent but a game centered on the Jedi Purge, without Jedi PCs, seems a little odd to me. With Jedi PCs allowed (creating the same problems as Slayer PCs) the game could quickly and easily be focused on them, with non-Jedi becoming supporting chars.
Solution? Involve the Jedi Purge as little as possible. How? Well, what else is happening at the same time? The Old Republic is falling and Palpatine is rising to become the Emperor. A lot of people are going to be unhappy about this and, as we know, these people evantually join together to form the Rebel Alliance.
Aha! Now, to my knowledge there is very little (if anything) that has been written about this time. I'm talking before Mon Mothma, Garm Bel Iblis and Bail Organa got round the table and signed the Corellian Treaty, formally creating the Rebel Alliance in the days where resistances were just forming, were disorganised, ill-funded, ill-equipped and easy prey for Palpatines new soldiers (read: Stormtroopers). This could open-up scope for all the character types Dave mentioned a few posts back without a particular emphasis on Jedi AND would allow for alleigances to this new growing resistance (and running from Palpatine's death squads, trying to help Jedi without attracting Vader's attentions, that sort of thing), the collapsing Republic (maybe trying to put off the inevitable, stalling Palpatine and his supporters without breaking the law, etc), Palpatine (killing everybody else :P) or simply neutral (criminals, bounty hunters, etc, caught up in the middle).
With this option, I think, we'd have less Luke Skywalker's running about and more Princess Leias, Han Solos, Wedge Antilles', Boba Fetts, etc, etc.
Of course, this does allow for Jedi characters, just no predominant Jedi focus. Jedi chars, of course, would be severly handicapped, but still playable if somebody really, really wants to be a Jedi.
So, taking Dave's analogy, it'd be Star Wars flavoured without necessarily involving Jedi. Get what I mean?
(And hows that for backing you up Jamie? lol)
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Wow, the Star Wars is sounding good. crap now I have no favour between FL and the SW...
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
I found this endlessly facinating...
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Okay. It's taken me far too long to jump into this discussion, but hey...I had other things on my plate. Promise that I'm getting back into the groove now. As such, I have an opinion and some thoughts.
First on the SW game (and this was discussed a bit when everyone was here visiting), I agree with the "no Jedi" rule, but I would like to clarify a bit. I don't think there should be actual Jedi in the game, but I do think the option should be open to playing "force sensitive" characters. Basically these are characters with innate force abilities and no training. For those of you who have read some of the SW novels, a prime example here are the witches of Dathomir. Basically, these characters have developed abilities naturally, but they probably don't think of them in terms of the force. The witches, for example, believe that they have 'magic'.
I think this should be what we allow. It means you have limits on what a character can actually do, potential for power to grow, but also you don't lose that 'fantasy flavor' that makes SW what it is.
Okay...that said, and for the record, I would rather play a smuggler I think, I'd like to discuss FL, or rather saving FL.
We talked a bit about this here and there. I for one do not want FL to go the way of Mythic and (what was that B5 game called) well...whatever. Let's try to work out a way to save this game, please....I just love it. It needs something, but at the core it's a great game with amazing potential.
Okay that's my bossy intervention. Feel free to smack me down or around as you see fit. (It is Dave's world after all, we all just live in it.)
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Well, my ideal would be to keep FL running - if we can get everyone interested in it and writing again. Jen has to study today, so I might do something set 5 or 6 years down the road if people want to use the machine war idea - really, it wasn't supposed to get that far, just had to map out the future which I was preventing. :)
Also for the SW thing, do like the idea of Force Sensitive characters, since they wouldn't be too overpowering. It also just occured to me, with the ultimate fanboy prop, that non-Jedi should (in theory) be able to use lightsabers. Just nowhere nearly as effectively.
So, here's what I propose: a preferential vote. We'll rank the following: starting Dave's FL idea, Shaun's FL time jump, and the SW game for what we propose, 1 to 3. Whatever gets the majority, we can set ourselves a deadline and go with. I'll abstain on this, give people time to vote, and only serve as a tie breaker.
Because, well, before we do anything at all, we have to decide what to do. :)
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Having seen "Star Wars: Revelations" it presented an idea I liked. There are a lot of Jedi wannabes who for one reason or the other were washed out of the Jedi Training program.
These rejects account for at least 1/3 of all the "force sensitives" in the galaxy. As long as there aren't a bunch of folks running around with Light Sabres, I'm okay with the idea of a Force Sensitive character who either doesn't understand or can't completely control his powers.
Or whose powers seem to act on their own - that is another option. All of those sound okay to me.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Quick note: Been yacking with Shaun, and he's got the idea for a major city as a venue rather than station. Got to say, that could work too. We need to start getting something together, though, if we want to run with this idea.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
I love this idea. The space station or the city. Can I submit my character for consideration now? Where do I sign up? Are you mod Adam?
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
I gotta say, im really excited for a Star Wars one...I would love to start that now :D....except of course not be a mod/admin, cause we all know how well that turned out for FL lol
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
In order - feel free to, I don't know, and I have an odd feeling I'm going to get saddled with the job. Which makes me... er... well, a bit nervous.
LNG's Third...Fourth Game
Well since Dave started something for proposals, I think I'm going to go and volunteer to be the one to maintain the actor list. May as well. ;)